Paddington Bear

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Posts by Paddington Bear

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  23

  Why Do JWs Believe They Have The "Truth" When Their View Keeps Changing?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't get it.. can anyone explain it to me?.

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  Paddington Bear

  I Never new it had a name.
  
  I used it once discussing things with my parents who are still in, my dad hated it:
  
  Cognitive dissonance - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance
  
  Millerites = JW's
  
  See the example they give of the "Great Dissapointment" as an example of it. Remind you of anybody - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Disappointment
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  101

  IMPORTANT: JWS and the CHARITIES COMMISSION

  by Dansk in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  dear all (especially those in the uk),.

  following on from danny's excellent post here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/128626/1.ashx i have just sent an e-mail to the charities commission.

  some time ago i wrote to you about the dangers of jehovah's witnesses and how they don't deserve charity status because far from helping mankind they are a real danger to it.

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  Paddington Bear

  I found this in the draft supplementary guidance produce by the charities commission for charities involved with the advancement of religion (http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Library/publicbenefit/pdfs/pbarsum.pdf). It is still at the consultation stage but one it comes into force the WTS and congregations will have to take note. As it states " When published it will form part of the Commission’s statutory guidance in this area, to which trustees must by law have regard". Unlawfully restricting a person’s freedom (Page 27) Some organisations advancing religion encourage their followers or adherents to live together in a religious community. Provided that members of the community are free to exercise personal choice as to whether they are at liberty to leave the community without intimidation or threat of repercussions, then public benefit will not be an issue on that ground. The freedom to exercise personal choice is not just an issue that applies to religious communities. To be for the public benefit, charities advancing religion must not unlawfully restrict the freedom of their followers or adherents to exercise this personal choice. Dangerous or damaging to mental or physical health (Page 26) One possible example of this type of detriment or harm is the refusal to allow medical treatment, or the taking of medicines, on religious grounds. The question of detriment or harm in this case hinges on a question of personal choice. Where the choice of whether to do so is made by a fully consenting adult, and the practice of not taking medicine or undergoing treatment can be justified through the teachings of the faith, this will not affect public benefit. The withholding, on religious grounds, of medical treatment without someone’s consent, or for children or other vulnerable people, is a contentious area. If consent is withheld because to administer such treatment would be contrary to a fundamental aspect of the faith, and if the withholding of consent is not against the law, or is managed by the law in another way, for instance by the state taking over the power to consent, then we would need to consider whether any possible damage to mental or physical health outweighs the general benefits of people having the freedom to follow their religion. Whilst exercising personal choice regarding medical treatment might not affect public benefit, public benefit is more likely to be an issue where an organisation advancing religion seeks to actively discourage members of the public in general from seeking medical treatment. Public benefit can also be called into question where there is evidence that the way in which a particular organisation advances a religion can be damaging to a person’s mental health, for example because of the techniques that it uses. I wonder how they will try and get around this........
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  101

  IMPORTANT: JWS and the CHARITIES COMMISSION

  by Dansk in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  dear all (especially those in the uk),.

  following on from danny's excellent post here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/128626/1.ashx i have just sent an e-mail to the charities commission.

  some time ago i wrote to you about the dangers of jehovah's witnesses and how they don't deserve charity status because far from helping mankind they are a real danger to it.

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  3. 
• 

  Paddington Bear

  I found this in the draft supplementary guidance produce by the charities commission for charities involved with the advancement of religion (http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Library/publicbenefit/pdfs/pbarsum.pdf). It is still at the consultation stage but one it comes into force the WTS and congregations will have to take note. As it states " When published it will form part of the Commission’s statutory guidance in this area, to which trustees must by law have regard". Unlawfully restricting a person’s freedom (Page 27) Some organisations advancing religion encourage their followers or adherents to live together in a religious community. Provided that members of the community are free to exercise personal choice as to whether they are at liberty to leave the community without intimidation or threat of repercussions, then public benefit will not be an issue on that ground. The freedom to exercise personal choice is not just an issue that applies to religious communities. To be for the public benefit, charities advancing religion must not unlawfully restrict the freedom of their followers or adherents to exercise this personal choice. Dangerous or damaging to mental or physical health (Page 26) One possible example of this type of detriment or harm is the refusal to allow medical treatment, or the taking of medicines, on religious grounds. The question of detriment or harm in this case hinges on a question of personal choice. Where the choice of whether to do so is made by a fully consenting adult, and the practice of not taking medicine or undergoing treatment can be justified through the teachings of the faith, this will not affect public benefit. The withholding, on religious grounds, of medical treatment without someone’s consent, or for children or other vulnerable people, is a contentious area. If consent is withheld because to administer such treatment would be contrary to a fundamental aspect of the faith, and if the withholding of consent is not against the law, or is managed by the law in another way, for instance by the state taking over the power to consent, then we would need to consider whether any possible damage to mental or physical health outweighs the general benefits of people having the freedom to follow their religion. Whilst exercising personal choice regarding medical treatment might not affect public benefit, public benefit is more likely to be an issue where an organisation advancing religion seeks to actively discourage members of the public in general from seeking medical treatment. Public benefit can also be called into question where there is evidence that the way in which a particular organisation advances a religion can be damaging to a person’s mental health, for example because of the techniques that it uses. I wonder how they will try and get around this........
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  17

  UK Charity Law Changes

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  you may or may not be aware but the charites act 2006 is now in force and it means that from end 2007 charites (including the jw's) will have to proove that they offer public benefit if they are to still retain their charitable status and in turn get gift aid on nearly every single donation and keep their tax exempt status.. the charity law association made some very interesting comments regarding the witnesses in their memorandum that was submitted in evidence to the joint commitee on the draft charites bill.

  their comments on the taylorite sect of the exclusive brethren "excluding children from the family home" is also quite relevant.

  this is only enidence from an outside body but it shows things could change.. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtchar/167/4061625.htm.

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  Paddington Bear

  My Understanding of it is that they will canvas questions on the Public Benifit Guidance that they have allready produced ( http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Library/publicbenefit/pdfs/publicbenefittext.pdf ) . This time they will ask questions regarding how this effects to the specific sub-sectors (i.e religions). You will not get the opportuntiy to ask your own questions but you can load the answers to the questions they give so that they go against the borg. From this they will produce suplimentary guidance for each subsector.

  If you look at the questions they gave on the draft public benifit guidance, this may give some idea as to what they are going to do. See page 12 of the following document http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/library/enhancingcharities/pdfs/pbconsult.pdf .

  I do not profess to know the ins and outs of the whole thing, but for me it is important to have a say....

  The reason why it was delayed.... I do not know... It is just late... The consultation should start in the next month or so. What ever happens its worth having a look at it

  taken form the guidance...

  "This is the Charity Commission’s statutory guidance on public benefit.

  The purpose of this guidance is to:

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  explain the requirement that, to be a charity in England and Wales, an organisation must have charitable aims that are for the public benefit;

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  raise awareness and understanding of that public benefit requirement amongst the public and the charitable sector;

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  explain how the public benefit requirement operates in practice; and

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  explain the new requirement for charity trustees to report on public benefit. This guidance deals with public benefit in general terms. It reflects recent changes in the law on public benefit arising from the Charities Act 2006. This guidance has been prepared following extensive public consultation. Separate guidance that explains the legal underpinning for the principles of public benefit set out in this guidance can be found in Analysis of the law underpinning Charities and Public Benefit on our website.

  We will publish supplementary guidance, after further consultation, about how the public benefit requirement applies specifically to different kinds of charity. "

  As they say this guidance is STATUTORY i.e the LAW..... Anything suplimentry should also be law also... If it goes to court this will be what they use to decide if a charity is a charity..

  Anyway..... as I say I do not profess to know th in's and out's of this but it is worth having a say in what is happening.....

  p.s... I know my spelling is bad so forgive me....
• 
  17

  UK Charity Law Changes

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  you may or may not be aware but the charites act 2006 is now in force and it means that from end 2007 charites (including the jw's) will have to proove that they offer public benefit if they are to still retain their charitable status and in turn get gift aid on nearly every single donation and keep their tax exempt status.. the charity law association made some very interesting comments regarding the witnesses in their memorandum that was submitted in evidence to the joint commitee on the draft charites bill.

  their comments on the taylorite sect of the exclusive brethren "excluding children from the family home" is also quite relevant.

  this is only enidence from an outside body but it shows things could change.. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtchar/167/4061625.htm.

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  Paddington Bear

  Betsey:

  It is not a "shamless repost"... That was posted in a few months back and I did not see it... As you can see from my posts (12 in over a year) I don't not use this board very much. Beleive me I have neither the desire nor need to plagerise!!

  Calm down lad...

  There is still consultation to take place on the supplementary guidence for sub-sectors including religion..

  S EIGHT:

  That was the main consultation on public benefit.. The will still publish further guidence on the subsectors (see 2.7 It says November 07 but it has been delayed untill Jan 08)

  email from CC dated 21/01/2008 below...................

  Dear Sir or Madam

  Charities and Public Benefit

  As someone who has requested to be informed of our further consultations on supplementary guidance for specific types of charity, we thought you might also like to be aware of the Charity Commission’s general guidance Charities and Public Benefit which has now been published. Copies of the publication can be found on our website at http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/publicbenefit/default.asp or obtained by contacting Charity Commission Direct.

  This published guidance follows our Consultation on Draft Public Benefit Guidance which we conducted last year. We were delighted with the response that we had to the consultation. Nearly a thousand organisations and individuals responded. All responses were carefully considered and have informed the revisions which we made to the guidance. We are very grateful to everyone who contributed to the consultation.

  Charities and Public Benefit is especially important for charity trustees. The Charities Act 2006 introduces a new duty for trustees to have regard to the Charity Commission guidance on public benefit. There will also soon be a new duty for trustees to report on their charity’s public benefit in their Trustee Annual Report.

  As you are aware, we will shortly begin a series of further consultations on the supplementary guidance on the public benefit for specific types of charity (or 'sub-sectors'). Our first set of sub-sector consultations will be on:

  • Public Benefit and the Prevention and Relief of Poverty
  • Public Benefit and the Advancement of Religion
  • Public Benefit and the Advancement of Education
  • Public Benefit and Fee-charging

  We will notify you regarding each sub-sector that you have expressed an interest in as soon as we are in a position to proceed.

  Yours faithfully

  Patrick Smidmore

  Patrick Smidmore
  Public Benefit and Status Policy
  +Woodfield House, Taunton, Somerset TA1 4BL
  : [email protected]
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  17

  UK Charity Law Changes

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  you may or may not be aware but the charites act 2006 is now in force and it means that from end 2007 charites (including the jw's) will have to proove that they offer public benefit if they are to still retain their charitable status and in turn get gift aid on nearly every single donation and keep their tax exempt status.. the charity law association made some very interesting comments regarding the witnesses in their memorandum that was submitted in evidence to the joint commitee on the draft charites bill.

  their comments on the taylorite sect of the exclusive brethren "excluding children from the family home" is also quite relevant.

  this is only enidence from an outside body but it shows things could change.. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtchar/167/4061625.htm.

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  Paddington Bear

  A food bank won't help them too much as the benifit has to directly relate to their aims as a charity. Their aims or objects are detailed on their registration with the charites commission:

  http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/registeredcharities/showcharity.asp?remchar=&chyno=1077961

  "TO ADVANCE THE CHRISTIAN RELIGION AS PRACTISED BY THE BODY OF CHRISTIAN PERSONS KNOWN AS JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES BY: (A) PREACHING THE GOSPEL OF GOD'S KINGDOM UNDER JESUS CHRIST UNTO ALL NATIONS AS A WITNESS TO THE NAME, WORD AND SUPREMACY OF ALMIGHTY GOD, JEHOVAH; (B) PRODUCING AND DISTRIBUTING BIBLES AND OTHER RELIGIOUS LITERATURE IN ANY MEDIUM AND EDUCATING THE PUBLIC IN RESPECT THEREOF; (C) PROMOTING RELIGIOUS WORSHIP; (D) PROMOTING CHRISTIAN MISSIONARY WORK; (E) ADVANCING RELIGIOUS EDUCATION; (F) MAINTAINING ONE OR MORE RELIGIOUS ORDERS OR COMMUNITIES OF SPECIAL MINISTERS OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES. "

  My understanding is that they will have to demonstrate the above gives public benifit. What will be harder is if the commission feel that their public benefit does not balance against any detriment or harm that they perceive they cause (no choice of blood transfusuins for children, exclusion of non-members, contravening the Data Protection Act (register of disfellowhipped persons at branch) etc....

  It should be a pretty tough year for them. Even if they are not struck off now, if enough people complain about them there is a strong possibility they could be in the future.
• 
  17

  UK Charity Law Changes

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  you may or may not be aware but the charites act 2006 is now in force and it means that from end 2007 charites (including the jw's) will have to proove that they offer public benefit if they are to still retain their charitable status and in turn get gift aid on nearly every single donation and keep their tax exempt status.. the charity law association made some very interesting comments regarding the witnesses in their memorandum that was submitted in evidence to the joint commitee on the draft charites bill.

  their comments on the taylorite sect of the exclusive brethren "excluding children from the family home" is also quite relevant.

  this is only enidence from an outside body but it shows things could change.. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtchar/167/4061625.htm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Paddington Bear

  You may or may not be aware but the Charites Act 2006 is now in force and it means that from end 2007 charites (including the JW's) will have to proove that they offer public benefit if they are to still retain their charitable status and in turn get gift aid on nearly every single donation and keep their tax exempt status.

  The charity law association made some very interesting comments regarding the witnesses in their memorandum that was submitted in evidence to the Joint Commitee on the Draft Charites Bill. Their comments on the Taylorite sect of the Exclusive Brethren "excluding children from the family home" is also quite relevant. This is only enidence from an outside body but it shows things could change.

  http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtchar/167/4061625.htm

  They are about to start consultations regarding what public benefit should mean for different charitable sectors, including religion. They are welcoming interested persons to take part and it would be a good way to get the point accross that certain organisations who's actions fall below what society expects nowadays should not have charitable/ tax excempt status. Whilst they are looking at public benifit they are also looking at what detrimental effect charites have and if these are sufficient they will take away thier charitable status.

  If any UK people want to take part the link is

  http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/enhancingcharities/pbconsult.asp#2.12

  From here you can email your details to take part in the consultation, just make clear you are interested in religious public benefit...
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  3

  MP3 Recorders.... The're great...

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have got some recordings of the judicial comitee hearings that i have been to over the past year.... it shows what a bunch of idiots they all really are.... if you want me to email them to you let me know... .

  if you also know of any good software to shorten it tell me as one of them is too large and needs cutting down.....

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  Paddington Bear

  I have got some recordings of the Judicial Comitee hearings that I have been to over the past year.... It shows what a bunch of idiots they all really are.... If you want me to email them to you let me know...
  If you also know of any good software to shorten it tell me as one of them is too large and needs cutting down.....
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  2

  MP3 Recorders.... The're great...

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have got some recordings of the judicial comitee hearings that i have been to over the past year.... it shows what a bunch of idiots they all really are.... if you want me to email them to you let me know... .

  if you also know of any good software to shorten it tell me as one of them is too large and needs cutting down.....

  1. 
  2. 
• 

  Paddington Bear

  I have got some recordings of the Judicial Comitee hearings that I have been to over the past year.... It shows what a bunch of idiots they all really are.... If you want me to email them to you let me know...
  If you also know of any good software to shorten it tell me as one of them is too large and needs cutting down.....
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  3

  Fight the Power!!!

  by Paddington Bear in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have been fighting a df'ing for quite a while now using the data protection act (uk law) for some months now with some limited success.

  mainly because i do not want to give the bas%a&ds the satisfaction of getting rid of me on their terms and telling my family what they can and can't do (some still jw's).

  does anyone have any experience in this or tried a similar tactic with them?

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  Paddington Bear

  I have been fighting a DF'ing for quite a while now using the Data Protection Act (UK Law) for some months now with some limited success. Mainly because I do not want to give the bas%a&ds the satisfaction of getting rid of me on their terms and telling my family what they can and can't do (some still JW's).
  
  Does anyone have any experience in this or tried a similar tactic with them?